Jiu-Jitsu Gave Him a Mission After Service

Speaker labels and mis-heard names are corrected by hand; the words are as spoken, filler and all.

Preview clips

Sean: At one point when I got out of the military, I had read every trans poor story about transitioning. I knew people that had bad transitions and then so when I do when I was in TAP, I like I went to TAP and I like took every note I could took down everybody's phone number, email address, like things I didn't even like I was like is this important? I did not want to end up another statistic. Like I be that a homeless veteran, be you know suicide, like whatever.

I'm looking at the base in my rearview mirror, like a scene out of a movie, like like literally like in it's in my rearview mirror and I am going, "Oh my god, what did I just do?" During that class, during lunchtime, the instructors would all roll and train jiu-jitsu actually. Um, and there was one guy that was taking the class and he would go train with them and I just watched him like he would beat the brakes off of the instructors and I went up to him and he was an army guy like he had like a ranger tab and I was like, "All right, this guy's cool." Like said I was like, "Dude, what do you like what do you do?" And then it's just like my I was like, "All right, I have to do this." You know, let's say, you know, you're a software engineer.

Just Google like software engineer meetups around me. Try it. Try it. And then maybe you go and they're like, "Ah, it's a bunch of losers. I don't want to go back." Cool. Don't go back. What would you waste a couple hours? You want to try jiu-jitsu? Come come into the gym. Not for you. No problem. Go try CrossFit. Try something, you know? Um, but I think it's just take I think like to answer your question, like just take some action. I don't care what that action is, but get yourself used to taking that action.

PJ: The hard part is you can't chase purpose. Purpose does not come from out there. It comes from in here.

Sean: My friend Kyle, he didn't go through our program, but he used jiu-jitsu. I mean, he was an addict, you know, had a family, but like maybe wasn't as involved as he as he should have been. And he credits jiu-jitsu, army veteran, you know, army combat veteran, early like early days of GWOT, like Iraq, Afghanistan. He did the whole thing. Army infantry guy, you know, as whatever typical story, right? Army infantry guy, early GWOT, gets out, gets put on a bunch of painkillers, gets addicted. You know, I'll let him tell a story if he ever wants to, but man, like he sings jiu-jitsu's praises.

I don't think he mind me talking about it either cuz he talks about this kind of stuff a lot and I've seen it like he was like the first guy I knew that happened to. And then I found this foundation and that's what they do.

PJ: I remember in the Marine Corps in the beginning I was at OCS and like every single night you make your bed, you stand across the other side, you slap the bed, honor, courage, commitment. Like every single night that's what they start with. They start with values. All right.

Sean: They don't know how to tie their white belt so it looks all crooked and and they're just like they're they're carrying themselves one way and then a year later it's not even that much time. A year later, man, I'm talking like they've repaired relationships with their family. There's like And by the way, we don't do any of that. we don't like facilitate a phone call with your aranged, you know, kids or something like that. People do that on their own. I need like I don't have that option.

That's that's it's off the table. So, I sat down and I was thinking like I sat I purposely sat down and said to myself, "What are you good at?" That's a hard conversation to have. My wife is as separated from the military as a community. But so, I went home and I was like, "Hey, you know, I'm deploying." You know, she understood. I think we were dating at the time, but she understood, you know, it's my job and cool. And then two days later, Sergeant Hill was like, "Hey, actually deployment's off." I said, "Okay." He's like, "You know, but keep your bags packed.

You know, everything like that. Things could change." Like, cool. So, I go home and try to tell my wife like, "Hey, it's off for now, but you know, these things, this is how they go." And then after like the that second or third time of it coming back on, I I had to stop telling her.

Conversation

PJ: Friends, welcome another episode of the Mastering the Military Transition series of the Prize Podcast. Today we have with us Sean um Robichaud. Did I say that right?

Sean: Robichaud. Robichaud. Robichaud.

PJ: Um, yes. Air Force veteran. I'm gonna let him introduce himself to a large uh extent here, but

I feel like you have a really cool story, my friend. So, let's start at start. Yeah. Um, how how did you become how did you go into the Air Force? Um, and then what was it like transitioning or while your time in the Air Force and then transitioning out? Just give me a high level overview.

Sean: Sure.

So,

uh, let's see. Where should I start?

I was I was playing music. I'll start there before we start when we talked last. Uh so I was playing music uh doing the whole band guy thing kind of thought I was like I don't need school. I don't need anything. I'm going to be a rock star you know that's uh and you know luckily I had some smart people advise me say maybe you should go to college okay I could play in a band while I go to college. So I did that and uh some point saw a lot of my friends a couple of my friends were being successful in music you know having doing touring doing the whole thing.

Most of the people in bands were not they you know what I mean and

PJ: starving artists.

Sean: Yeah, exactly. And I was like, hey, that's cool. Like, I like doing this, but maybe I should explore some other things. So, the military had kind of always been on my mind. My dad was in the Navy. I think at that point, my brother was in the Navy. Grandpa's, you know, the whole the whole deal. Typical. Um, so I started looking around and the Air Force kind of came into my purview. Said, "I'm definitely not going to join the Navy. You're not gonna stick me in a boat for eight months." Like, I was might know something about that.

Um Um, so yeah, I ended up joining the Air Force. Um, typical like just walked in the recruiter one day said, "I'd like to be in the Air Force." And he said, "Sure, here you go." And so that's pretty pretty simple. Uh,

but uh, you know, then went into, you know, did six years active duty. Um, I said relatively uneventful. Had a had a good time. You know, typical like positive things. Get out of the military. You get to go cool places, meet cool people, do cool stuff.

PJ: Yeah. Yeah.

Sean: Um, did all that. uh started my transition out in 2022. Um was doing a lot at the time. Went to grad school as soon as I got out, which was ended up being a good decision. That is 100% my wife's decision. She was that was that was all her. Ended up being a very positive decision. No, I

knew I kind of wanted to get into entrepreneurship, but I was kind of removed from being a civilian. So, it grad school was a really good way for me like to to to aid in the transition, right? To start learning about the civilian world a little bit more. But I had like the safety net of I was still in school.

Um,

sure, we'll get into more specifics, but ended up starting like a photography videography business. Got to do some really, really cool stuff with that. That sort of transitioned into me starting a marketing company. Um, which is what I do now. I have a couple marketing companies. I work with a bunch of different companies in a bunch of different uh, areas. And yeah, so I kind of fell into that like entrepreneur life and I also have like 10,000 other things going on as well. But those are the highlights.

PJ: Yeah. Hey, that's cool, man. Um, and actually we we share a little bit of a background there too, you know, music and and punk rock specifically. Um, so that's that's kind of fun. You actually in some ways remind me of a little bit of my basis that I had in high school. So that's kind of funny. Um, cool man. Hey, so Air Force, what was your MOS?

Sean: So by trade I was a 2T351, which is vehicle management. Um, so I would say it's like the least Air Force job in the Air Force.

People like, "Oh, fly and drive."

Be like, "What'd you fly?" I was like, "MRAPs." That's uh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, like it just like the the career field itself works. We they handle everything from like the maintenance to the, you know, managing uh where the vehicles go, if we loan them out or anything like that. Um I I almost talk about myself a little bit of separation from the career field because while it is a great career field if you're in it, um and that's what you like to do. I do not love the work. So, I was always doing something different. Um,

and to be, you know, to be to give credit where credit's due, like I I had good enough leadership at certain like critical points that like I was able to do that kind of stuff, like combatives instructor. Um, I did a stint with the base honor guard. Like I did that kind of stuff. I augmented security forces for a little bit. Um

PJ: Oh, cool.

Sean: Yeah. And that that's just kind of like those things were a little bit more my speed. And um so that's why I would like yes I was tackling a 2T351 but like I almost feel like I'm like stealing their valor like when I do that cuz I was like dude do not you don't want me wrenching on your car. That's not true.

PJ: Oh you don't like crank around in your car on the weekends.

Sean: Dude I want to change my own oil. Like I hate working on vehicles.

PJ: Interesting.

Sean: Um yeah I kind of got uh I got like placed there by the Air Force. I was like I didn't really you know what I was getting into but uh yeah so it was like one of those things where but like I I have I don't when I talk about with like separation I have an immense amount of respect for the guys in that field cuz it's not an easy job.

No it's not dude and like and these guys are they're not just wrenching on vehicles. That's kind of what everybody thinks but like these guys are out doing convoy work. They're a lot of times they're attaching to like the army or even like attach like we work with the Seabees. Uh our like tech training is all like same as like Seabees. So like we work with those guys. Yeah. And these guys are like I mean I have so many friends that have been like like I don't know working on breaks in the middle of firefights, you know, that kind of thing. So it's it's a very cool career field. It just like I I just like

it just wasn't for me.

PJ: Yeah.

Sean: So I always feel like like feel like I'm stealing valor because I know like I know some of these guys, man, they can like they hear an engine and it's making a certain noise and okay, we just go in blah blah blah blah this like that and then like while bullets are flying. It's crazy. It's insane. These guys are awesome.

PJ: That is cool.

Yeah. Wow. Actually, I didn't know that. Interesting. Yeah. And and were you were you deployed over overseas at any point?

Sean: No, I actually Yeah, I six years active duty, zero deployments. That's I was

not post GWOT, but towards the end.

PJ: Oh. Oh, for sure. For sure. Okay. So,

when when you got out

Sean: Yeah.

PJ: Um I don't just want to skip over some of this stuff, but to to pull the thread a little bit.

I know that, you know, jiu-jitsu has been a big thing in your life. So, and we're we're probably going to be touching a lot on that during this episode. But, um, when did you get introduced to, let's say, hand to hand combat?

Sean: Sure. Um, so I had some interest in like combat sports before I even joined the military. Um, but I never like formally trained. I I was actually watching like I was like, you know, UFC was definitely a thing when I was in high school, but like I would watch UFC. I'd watch like WEC, which is like an older league. Like I'd watch like everything. I I mean I definitely couldn't afford to train at the time. Um

and then I just like I just never did. I always had like other stuff going on. And then

I took my first jiu-jitsu class like a year before I joined the military. I was working at this coffee shop. This dude who's actually ex-Marine uh he'd like get coffee at our shop every day and one day he was wearing a jiu-jitsu shirt and I'm like I I like I know of jiu-jitsu. Let me let me try a class. And like I tried a class I was like I loved it but like I just couldn't afford it. Um, so I really kind of got started uh when I was in the military. It's actually it's an interesting story. Uh,

please you don't mind? Okay, please. I don't want to start rambling.

PJ: No, tell us the story.

Sean: I've told this story on another podcast, but the reason I trained jiu-jitsu, like the reason jiu-jitsu became a big part of my life, I owe it to like one dude who's actually a good friend of mine now.

Um, so the opportunity came up for to take the combative instructor course. Um, just like where I was working, went to my command. I was like, "Hey, can I take this?" They're like, "Yep, go ahead. like I know this is what you want to do. So I had taken like you know Air Force combatives before but like no offense to any of you uh military combatives guys out there

and they're doing a better job like they're modernizing now but like for a long time I think like you probably remember like the MCMAP and stuff like that.

— It was just like I knew how to get my ass kicked in a bar.

Sean: Yeah, ideally uh and hopefully the the you know the the military combatives have come a long way in the past couple years which I'm very happy about. Good. Um, and so like kind of went on a tangent, but I was so I went and go take this course and uh while I'm taking this course, pretty intense course I was like a week long and like I look back on it now I'm like I cannot believe that was actually the how the course went cuz again I don't want to go too all over the place, but the the instructors of that course actually ended up getting in a little bit of trouble from what I heard cuz we all walked out of there with like a couple guys had like torn MCL's like a like I was more bruised than man by the end of this. I had a blast in this course, but it was one of those things where they may have gone a little too

I don't know, they did some stuff they maybe weren't supposed to do. I appreciated it though. I If you guys any of those instructors are out there, I thought it was awesome. I had a great time.

PJ: Right. Right. Right.

Sean: So, sorry not to go too off topic.

PJ: No, not at all.

Sean: But, um,

so during that class during lunchtime, the instructors would all roll and train jiu-jitsu actually. Um, and there was one guy that was taking the class and he would go train with them and I just watched [clears throat] him like I don't want to swear but like he would beat the brakes off of I probably already have to. Uh,

— I totally did, man.

Sean: He would beat the brakes off of the instructors. And I went up to him and he was an army guy. Like had like a ranger tab and I was like, "All right, this guy's cool." Like said I was like, "Dude, what do you like what do you do?" He's like, "Oh, I'm a purple bell or a brown belt in Brazilian jiu-jitsu." And then it's just like my head I was like, "All right, I have to do jiu-jitsu now." So that class ended on a Friday. on Monday.

I was stationed at McGuire in New Jersey at the time. I that Monday I drove to Philadelphia to the current gym that I train at and I was like, I need to sign up. Like I need to do this, you know. So that's actually how I got started. And

that guy and I we actually we we ended up becoming friends cuz uh one of those things where it was like one course, met the guy, it was quick. Couple years later, I'm actually training at my gym in Philly. And when during that course, that guy had like a hoodie and on that hoodie, he had like a logo of a company that he owned. It was a very recognizable logo. had like the Ranger Flash and stuff, firearms destruction company.

One of my coaches, my jiu-jitsu coach comes in wearing that hoodie

and I go, "Yeah." And I was like, "Some random guy met when I was in Milton." I said, "Do you know that guy?" He's like, "Yeah." I said, "Does he like live around here?" He's like, "He lives in Delco." He's like, "No kidding."

I was like, "Yeah." Told him the story. Couple months after that, one of my buddies, firefighter comes to me and goes, "Hey, one of my friends is deployed to Iraq right now. He's actually teaching jiu-jitsu out there. They need gis. Can you help me organize a gi drive and kind of get the stuff downrange?" And I was like, "Yeah, I could. You know, easy." So whatever, we get all these gis package up. He goes, "Oh, my buddy sent me a picture of them like wearing the gis we sent them." And it's that dude.

And yeah, and like I was like, "All right, I got to find this guy."

So a couple months after that, literally just one day I'm training, he walks in the gym and he probably thought I was the weirdest dude in the world cuz I just ran up to him. I was like, "Hey, do you remember me from like this oneweek class we took a couple years ago?" And he was like,

"No."

Yeah. No, very much like a It was just very much like a uh he was like, "Who?" And then it like kind of hit him. He was like, "Oh my god." He's like, "What are you doing here?" I was like, "I trained here." And uh yeah, it was crazy. He's actually like a really really good friend of mine. I was just at his house on Sunday. Like is

PJ: Well, it's cool too because he was your inspiration.

Sean: Yeah.

— Right.

PJ: Yeah. So that dude had an immense effect on your life that he probably wasn't even aware of at the time. Right.

Sean: And I freaked him I freaked him out by like running. I was like, "Hey, you don't know this, but like everything I do now involves jiu-jitsu and you're the reason." He's like, "Hey,

that's cool, though."

PJ: And I wonder I mean, how did he take that? Did he ever say like I mean

Sean: he was he there's a reason we're friends? He like once he processed it, he was like, "That's cool as shit." Like and then we just instantly became friends after that.

PJ: No, that's beautiful. Um it is really cool that we can have the effects that we do on people and we don't even realize it a lot of times. Yeah.

Um that's that's really really cool, man. So, all right. you I mean I'm sure that your Air Force career wasn't as benign as you made it sound.

Sean: Yes.

PJ: Um do you mind talking about anything that may have stuck with you at any point in time?

Sean: Yeah. So

PJ: and frame it however you like. I mean if

Sean: Sure. Yeah.

I mean like just like anybody else the military has its ups and downs most. You know what I mean? It's it's

when times are great times are great. And when times aren't great times aren't so great. And um you know, one thing I struggled with a lot like we you talked about before like I never deployed. I had um and that still bugs me to this day a little bit. I've kind of come to you know terms of it a little bit but you know like I got out in 20 I was in 2016 22 everybody I knew deployed.

PJ: Yeah. Absolutely.

Sean: And you know, it it it is something that still, you know, to this day, you know, it's just just one of those things where I'm like, man, I did a lot of practice, didn't do the job. Um and I had a lot of friends that you know like all my friends uh you know they they they did their thing and they did it well and uh a lot of people I'm very proud of

and even people like in like different career fields you know my career field I met a bunch of people from different career fields and um you know but like so like the one I said one but like I just you know one the draw down in Afghanistan I was that was like that was a particularly stressful time um and something that kind of like again still kind of putting everything together. It was super hectic. Um, you know, I'm sure I don't know, were you in at the time?

PJ: No. No. My brother-in-law was he was in the Air Force. He was he was flying uh

I'm going to screw this up. C-5s or C-17s?

Sean: C-17s.

PJ: Um, and and he was part of the whole like

Sean: Yeah.

PJ: out there. And I know that hit him pretty hard.

Sean: I Yeah, exactly. It was It was just a lot. And it was a lot like really quick. And I think we kind of touched on this before we started recording, but like the reason I think that sticks with me is because I almost felt guilty about how much it bugged me because I was in New Jersey the whole entire time.

PJ: Yeah.

Sean: We were, you know, running ops and we were doing stuff and we were, you know, refugees and planes coming in and like it it was crazy. Um, I was like sending guys out the door to Afghanistan, you know, bringing people back. It was nuts. Like I think that's one of the things that stuck with me too. It's like a lot of times you send somebody out the door and they're gone for a couple months and then like we'd send people out the door and then they be back with a plane full of refugees in three days and you're just like right.

Um and then like you know I I I got to see a lot of the um the the people who were living their whole life in Afghanistan. Just regular people never even thought about coming to New Jersey. All of a sudden flip of the hat they're walking off this plane. saying, you know, they're in a strange land. It's, you know, moms, kids. New Jersey strange land.

— New Jersey is a very strange land compared to New Jersey.

Sean: They should should have sent him to another. Uh, yeah. And so like that, I just remember like all that, you know, a lot lot of chaos. Um, I also had um a little before that during the COVID era, just another thing that's like stuck with me. And I think this is something that I'd like to, you know, it was it was a it was a challenge at the time, but I think ended up being a strength. Um, and I think everybody in the military has dealt with something like this, but I had a deployment one time, um, cancelled and reput.

PJ: Wow.

Sean: Eight in a month-long span.

PJ: Wow.

Sean: So, it was like one of those things where the best um, probably the best military leader I ever had, and actually, he's out now, so I can shout him out. Sergeant Hill, if you're watching this, you probably will be. Uh, he's he's the man. Probably the best leader I ever had in the military. I mean, hands down. Master Sergeant at the time. um did not get the credit he deserved for how good of a military leader this guy was, which is often the case.

— Often the case. Um

Sean: but he literally called me into his office one day like, "Hey man, like you know, we got this deployment uh to Africa. You know, you're going to leave this time." I like, "Okay, cool. Check." So go home, tell my wife, who's by the way just pure civilian. Um zero military. She is my wife is as separated from the military as a human being can get. Like it's it's in a good way, in a positive way. It's part of the reason you joined the military so the rest of the population doesn't have to. You know what I mean? And um

but so I went home and I was like, "Hey, you know, I'm deploying, you know, she understood. I think we were dating at the time, but she understood, you know, that's my job." And cool. And then two days later, Sergeant Hill's like, "Hey, actually deployment's off." I said, "Okay." He's like, "You know, but keep your bags packed. You know, everything like that. Things can change." Like, cool. So, I go home and try to tell my wife like, "Hey, it's off for now, but you know, these things this is how they go." And then after like the that second or third time of it coming back on, I I had to stop telling her. Yeah. I just said assume I said assume, you know, like assume I'm going. Um

I said if they if I don't go, then I don't go, you know, whatever. And uh I don't remember why it ultimately ended up getting cancelled, but it was right around the time COVID kicked off. And I do remember my commander went like there was a couple of us that were going to go and like squadron commander like we all like met with him and he was like it was probably like early 2019 and he was like or early 2020 and he was like hey there's like this virus you know we all we're all at that and then he's like I don't know if it's going to affect anything whatever and then two weeks later they're like base is shut down every nobody's moving no movement no nothing like this like I had a friend who was out um just like at a FOB in Iraq it was like him and like five SEALs and I got stuck out there for like six months, you know, like Yeah. It's like

um so like

that, you know, that I mean the co that was just to say like the co era was crazy. But that whole like

deployment on deployment canceled like eight times eight times in a month. Me and me and me and that guy Marcus Hill we still we still talk about that like to this day which how crazy was that? He would walk into like where I was working and I'd see him and I'd go

let me guess.

— Yeah.

Sean: And he'd be like I'm sorry, you know.

PJ: Well, let let's let's rewind for a second. Uh I because I I understand where you're coming from and like you almost feel bad for feeling the way that you did because you you couldn't fulfill the mission that you were trained to fulfill.

Sean: Yeah.

PJ: Right. And a lot of the reasons that a lot of us joined the military to begin with, believe it or not, I don't think that's uncommon.

I really don't. Uh, in fact, I've had guests on the podcast where like one of his biggest traumas was exactly that, you know, as a Marine, like he he never got to go and it it was just a timing thing and it worked out that way. So, I don't think that's uncommon at all. And I I if there's people watching right now that clearly you're not alone here, right? This is something that happens and it's an interesting trauma and I'm going to use the word trauma because we did something for some reason.

We prepared ourselves mentally for something that didn't happen. And one of the things that's really interesting I think in life is almost all suffering in life is because our expectations didn't meet reality.

Yeah. Right. And it's it can boil down to about that much of a simplicity. And when it's when it's something as ingrained in you as the military, that expectation becomes much bigger, right? So I please don't feel bad about it. I hope you at this point in life have been able to process that. But also, you're not alone. You're not alone at all. Um, so let's fast forward to like getting out. Like what what was that like for you when when you were transitioning out of the military? Like what was the process? Was it just you were done with the contract? Like what was that?

Sean: Yeah. Yeah. So, I just did six year I had a six-y year contract, finished the six years. Um, I think this is probably a good time to bring in the jiu-jitsu stuff we've been teasing because this is uh,

you know, I think this is where, as we've talked about, I think this is like a little unique part of my transition that I'm hoping and and I think other people can hopefully take something please take something useful out of this. Uh, it's uh, uh, even if it's a boring story, but so six years was up. I knew I was getting out. I was ready to get out um, for a multitude of reasons, right? I'm sure

if you're military people listening to this, you can imagine.

Yeah. as you can imagine. But I I felt like I had a good time my my six years. Um but I was done. And so for me, as I said, I can't really tell the story without adding in the what where Brazilian jiu-jitsu kind of came in and helped me with my transition. So I, as I said, after that class, I trained. And so my my life became about training. That was what I did when I wasn't at work. Um so I still do when I'm not at work.

Um, and um, and and for a multitude of reasons we'll get into, but I was I I got out my last day was a Tuesday. Um, and I will just never forget this because Tuesday 7 p.m. we have no gi class at my gym. Um, I left the base at, you know, whatever time, four o'clock or whatever. I'm looking at the base in my rearview mirror, like a scene out of a movie, like like literally like in it's in my rearview mirror and I am going, "Oh my god, what did I just do?" I have spent, you know, six years in and then the year before preparing as the last seven years of my life have been all about the military. I'm not in the military anymore. Oh, what do I do?

PJ: Yeah.

Sean: And that's in my head and I have about an hour drive to my gym. Um, bunch of guys would get there early, too. You know, we always there's always something going on. So, I was like, I'm just going to go over to the gym and uh I get that all in my head, man. Like all just what did I make the right choice? Is this crazy? Should I try to drive back and have them try to let me in?

I've screwed up. Uh, and as I'm thinking about this, I that whole hour I walk into my gym and my buddy Dan is there and Dan, it's just for him it's just Tuesday and he goes, "Oh, good. You're here. Hey, I want to work on something on the mat." And like that instant, like that instant, my transition was made infinitely easier because Dan didn't care that it was my last day in the military. He didn't even know like I mean I probably told him at some point, but like uh he didn't know it was my last day in the military.

He did not just dedicate the last six years of his life in the military. he is just showing up to jitsu class and wants to train a new move he's been working on. That's that's it. You know what I mean? And so I was able to take that all this chaos going in my head and I said, you know, you you put it to the side for a second because I got to help Dan learn this move. And I gave me something to focus on. And once I had that,

you know, every quiet the noise for a little bit, become a little more clear so when the noise does come back now, you can manage it. Now it's not so overwhelming. Mhm.

So that's, you know, that that was like really the first part played in my in my transition. Um,

PJ: interesting. And what? Okay. So, was it the the focus that he like broke your state basically? Is is that what it was? Or was it that someone someone needed you for something? Or was it both?

Sean: It's a good question. I would I'd adv for I can't collect my thoughts because you just brought up a really good point. Uh no, that's I'm I've never had anybody ask me that before. I think it was the focus. I that's kind of what I've been operating on these past couple years. every time I think about this story, but I've never considered like, oh, somebody needed me for something, you know, but maybe that did play into a little bit and I just wasn't even, you know, if my my favorite part about being in the military, like I think it's a lot of people's favorite parts is like you have the ability to like directly help people all the time, whether that be you're, you know, downrange physically helping, you know, I don't know, liberate people ideally, uh, or you have subordinate troops that you can help, you know, navigate through something like that's that's always the most rewarding part for me.

PJ: Oh, totally agree.

Sean: Yeah, exactly. just being able to help people navigate. Uh, and yeah, maybe so maybe that was part of it. I never thought about that.

PJ: Well, so I asked this question because I think that a lot of us when we when we get out people that I've seen that really overcome something very very big and there's, you know, this is a a continuum. It's not just a one or a zero, right? But the people that have been able to really overcome the big thoughts and the big feelings, stuff like that, are the ones who have found someone else to serve in the process.

You know what I mean? And we join the military, whether we realize it a lot or not a lot of times, is because we want to serve. It's in the name. We're service members, right? Um, so I find that if people can step outside of themselves and go, well, I'm here for a bigger reason and I'm going to leverage whatever it may be in nonprofit or jiu-jitsu or whatever to better somebody else um, and better themselves actually because it's a part of it.

Sean: 100%.

PJ: A lot of times it makes that transition a lot easier because it's

— it's purpose.

— Yeah.

PJ: You know what I mean?

Sean: Uh yeah. Yeah. 100% of what you're saying. I don't think it's a I don't think it's a coincidence that I mean I work directly with two nonprofits, you know, veteran based nonprofits and then I I feel like I'm always doing something for some, you know, others. I was trying to help guy. I'm sure you're probably in a similar boat. I feel like a lot of us do transition to working with nonprofits, especially like in the veteran space because that's exactly what you just said. You know, it's it's fulfilling for us and it we want to serve others.

I want to help people in my community. I say this all the time, like you know, the last squadron I was in was a logistics squadron. As a logistics squadron, your job is to support the war fighter.

PJ: Yeah.

Sean: That wanting to support the war fighter like that doesn't go away when you get out.

PJ: No.

Sean: You know? Yeah. And so that's kind of like what I've been trying to do with the foundation and with all that is like I'm just because I'm out of this military doesn't mean I'm going to stop helping you know to like people that we were in with like they they like they I don't want to say they need my help but they you know a lot of people need some help and I needed help and I still do. So if anybody wants to help uh I got a lot of questions about a lot of things.

Uh uh yeah. Yeah. Exactly. You know we help each other out and then it's uh I think that type of thing it doesn't go away like it's it was it was

— doesn't go away.

Sean: Yeah. Yeah. It's not like the contract's over. I don't care about anybody, you know? I'm not part of this. I know it's a cliche term, but like the I'm not part of this brotherhood anymore. It's it's it's still there, you know.

PJ: Well, the military, I think, in a lot of ways, it meets a lot of our needs.

Yeah. You know, in a lot of ways. And if you look at some of the more basic ones and even some of the more spiritual ones, if you will, and I'm going to use the the six human needs per Tony Robbins on this one, but like, you know, certainty. You're in the most structured certain environment, you know, in a lot of ways that you can get, right? You you know where to be, what to wear, what to say, how to stand, you know, how to tie your shoelaces in a lot of ways, right?

And when you get out, that's gone,

you know? So I think what's interesting a lot of times in transition is that structure we take for granted and that's one of the first things that's pulled out from underneath us and by the way it's also the bottom of Maslow's hierarchy of needs. So your most basic human need your most primal need is now gone over overnight. Mhm.

And I think that that's also a big reason why a lot of and sorry for the tangent, but why a lot of us wind up going and being like job job, right? Because the job has to replace my certainty or my need for certainty.

Uh and usually there's a lot more deeper things that we have to deal with, right? But that's what we index on.

So certainty, uncertainty. Oh my god, you just said you had eight times back and forth, you know, on this on this one deployment. Like that's uncertainty, variety, but it gets rid of boredom. You know what I mean? So that's also a human need. They conflict, but we need both. Um you have, you know, significance. Think about how important a lot of times we feel in the military. I'm doing something for my country.

I am, you know, part of the the reason that we can live the free lives. You said it. So like I joined the military and to a lot of civilians don't have to. You know, there's significance that comes along to that. We all have a need for significance. Love and connection. Think about brotherhood that we have in there or I don't want to say brotherhood, brotherhood, sisterhood. Like we have a unit that we all belong to. you know, we we we're meeting at least those four needs on a very very high level.

And then you throw so throw something in like contribution. I'm giving back. I'm supporting the war fighter, right? And and growth, you know, learning and growth. It meets literally all six of your needs on a very high level if you let it, you know, and and that can be very very challenging to replace out in the real world.

So, why am I bringing this up? You got into jiu-jitsu and we just talked about two needs right off the bat. Well, implicitly talked about one which is contribution. Now, I wonder about the other ones.

Sean: Yeah.

PJ: So,

Sean: it's all there.

PJ: It's all there, right?

Sean: And I'm not I'm not here as a salesman for jiu-jitsu today. If you would like to train jiu-jitsu, I would recommend it. Um, but there is what jiu-jitsu did for me, I'm sure you can find elsewhere. Um,

but I I'm I'm glad you transitioned into this because this is this is kind of what I wanted to talk about. And if I think if I can be useful to anybody, which is my whole goal in life, I I please if you're watching this, like

and you take anything from it, I don't know a lot about anything. I'm not an expert on anything. I have dedicated a lot of my life to the jiu-jitsu community and there's a reason for that. Um and I reason I use the term jiu-jitsu community. Um it is a community.

PJ: Yeah. Oh yeah.

Sean: And a lot of people I think from the outside have a skewed perception of what jiu-jitsu is. Um, rightfully so. You don't know anything until you do it. You look at the military before you join. You don't know what that's going to be like. Um, and I think a lot of people, especially veterans, when they come across jiu-jitsu, it's usually from somebody like Jocko or Joe Rogan who are great sp like both those guys are great spokesman for the sport. Um, Jocko does a ton, you know. Um, but when they like

PJ: books on it.

Sean: Yeah, exactly. He's got books on it and and Jocko is actually still very involved. His daughter is a phenomenal, dude. She's awesome. She's

She's great. Um

PJ: that's awesome.

Sean: Yeah. Um

but uh but so my point with bringing guys like that up is is what I think a lot of veterans I think a lot of us come across uh people hear about jiu-jitsu from those guys or something like that and which is great. Um but if you don't look into it, you might think like oh jiu-jitsu is just something like for for bros or like it's about discipline and stuff like that. And I hey if that's your thing that's your thing. I'm not like one of these like hard like I wake up when I wake up.

Um I mean I exercise every day, eat right, um work hard and everything like that. Um I'm not a big motivational poster guy and if you are nothing wrong with it. One of one of the brands I work with my best friends own a brand that's that make their whole living. Um, so what I try to like demystify about jiu-jitsu to people, especially like other vets, is that like if that's what you want it to be, if you want that discipline, hard work, this like it's structure as you talked about, it's there.

We got it. You know what I mean? We it's it's all yours. But if you're somebody like me who actually when I was in the military, one of the things you just fulfilled for me was like a lack of structure. Um, we both played in punk rock bands. I didn't always do great with authority as a kid. Uh,

PJ: oh man. Let's pull that thread a little bit.

Sean: Um, no, I mean, I I was I was actually I was a pretty good kid. I just uh

you know, there's like a certain whatever there's a certain personality type I think plays in music. Yeah. And so um but um but what what jiu-jitsu gives you is uh is is unstructured time if that's what you want. You know what I mean? Like I jiu-jitsu is

there's it can be anything you want it to be, but like for me it's a it's it's a weird word to use, but like think of like I'm using this in like an Animal Planet sense of the word. Uh like it's play,

you know? I get to mess around. I get to mess around. I get to do stuff. I get to try new things. And especially as you like learning, get better. As you're learning, you're trying, you're having fun, you're doing something that's good for you. Um,

kind of went off a tangent here from my wife from the Jocko stuff. I go off on a lot of tangents. I apologize. Uh, long-winded is definitely Yeah. Uh,

PJ: you're good, my friend.

Sean: So, uh, but anyway, it, you know, with with with the with the veteran community, I think it's cool to have a space coming out of the military where you have that structure, where you have all of those things you talked about. And jiu-jitsu is probably the closest thing I have found to to all of that. Um, for the the reason being is that it's it's a community. I my gym I mean, I train at a bunch of different gyms. My home gym is Balance Studios in Philadelphia. Uh, great great gym. Uh, my best friends are there.

You know what I mean? It's that's people are like, "Well, how do you train jiu-jitsu five times a week?" I'm like, "Cuz I want to train seven, you know what I mean? Like I but I have other things to do." Um, it's like, why would I not go? It's like it's my favorite thing I like doing. All my best friends are there. Like, it's it's the best. You know what I mean? And that's why the the kind of cliche joke is it's funny because people are like, "Oh, jiu-jitsu requires discipline.

You got to show up every day. You got to work hard." I'm like, "Maybe for some people, but dude, not for me. It's it's really hard for me. Like I skipped jiu-jitsu today to come here. Like I mean I'm happy to. Um but it's uh I think this is definitely this is definitely a worthy reason to skip. Uh but it's you know it's like it's like when you get hurt like if I like have like a smaller injury or something like that and I'm like it'd be smart to like take two through wicket. That's the hardest part of jiu-jitsu is staying

staying away from it. Yeah.

Um so it's it's funny because some people get in because they're like I want discipline. I want that. I'm like you're going to get it but not not in the way you think. It's

PJ: Well, I think it's and how you put it in there, right? Um, actually the last episode that we had I thought was really interesting because so uh I don't know if you watched it at all but uh Justin Wright he one of the things he talked about was he had a lack of discipline in getting out is what he said but I asked him I was like you know was it actually a lack of discipline or was it an unfocused discipline because you didn't have you were disciplined about taking the drugs right

so and and so the reason I bring that up though is I I think people have a very narrow view of discipline.

Sean: Yeah.

PJ: You know what I'm saying?

Sean: I completely agree

PJ: to to you. You just named I work out five times a week. I eat right. You're disciplined. It just probably doesn't necessarily look the way that it does to everyone else.

Sean: Sure.

PJ: You know, because you have built probably an identity around it, you know, so it's not necessarily like I'm this and I'm this and I'm this. It's just No, it's part of who I am and I just do it.

Sean: Yes. 100%.

PJ: You know what I'm saying? Exactly. Um, I I love the book, I think it's Atomic Habits, where he talks about like, who's the dude that's gonna quit smoking? The dude that's like, "Oh, it's been 10 days or the dude that's like, I'm not a smoker."

Sean: Exactly.

PJ: You know what I mean?

Sean: Exactly.

PJ: Then it's the discipline is a whole another level at that point because it's not something you have to make so structured. It's something that's just it's a part of you.

Sean: Yeah.

Right. That's Yeah. I I I like I like the phrasing that way. Yeah. That's that's it. And and you're right cuz I'm using the term discipline as like the almost like the meme of what discipline is,

— right?

Sean: Yeah. You know what I mean? Like it but you're right. You know, it does it it it's uh it especially like getting started in something like jiu-jitsu. It's like Yeah. It's

it you have to build that like you have to like build your identity build that because I have news for you guys like if you're going to start jiu-jitsu, you're going to get beat up a little bit.

PJ: Yeah.

Oh, I'm sure.

Sean: And that's that's when it's hard. But I tell you what, like it's the the running thing in jiu-jitsu is they always say like the hardest belt to get is your white belt because that means like you showed up and people have a lot of mis you know preconceived notions. I actually teach like 101 class at my gym. So like your first day of jiu-jitsu like I'm the guy who's teaching you and I I hear it all people coming in with like these like preconceived what they think it's going to be and you would not believe how many people think that their day one they're going to come in and I'm just going to beat the [expletive] out of them.

PJ: Really?

Sean: Oh, so many people are like, "Hey, like, you know, I just like," and I'm like, "Hey, man. Like, I if PSA, if you're going to a jiu-jitsu gym and your first day people are just beating the [expletive] out of you, leave that gym immediately. That is not a good place to be." Now, you come, you learn for a couple months, you know, whatever, then we throw you into the deep end a little bit. Then you're going to start getting beat up a little bit. Um,

but, uh, yeah, your first day, please, for the love of God, if you go to a gym and you get beat up your first day, leave. Go to a different gym. There's plenty there's plenty of great gyms out there.

PJ: Mhm. I got a question for you, I'm sure. Yes. Um, what would you say your values are?

Sean: Ooh, that's a good question. That is a very good question. Oh man,

that is a hard one.

PJ: It is a very hard one. Uh,

boil it down. Um, what's something you got really really pissed about recently?

Sean: Ooh. Okay, this is going to sound silly, but I think it's a good starting point hopefully. Uh, I don't like when people are late to things.

PJ: Okay.

Sean: And the last thing I got pissed about was somebody being late to something.

PJ: Okay. So, so boil that down.

Sean: Yeah.

PJ: Was it What was the What was the re What was the story that went in your head as to why you were mad they were late?

Sean: My I boil being late down to you don't respect respect.

PJ: Respect. Exactly. So, there you go. There's I need to find something.

So, so you value respect.

Sean: Yes. 100%.

PJ: Okay. Um, what's something that you were were very delighted about that someone did recently?

Sean: Um, oh, that's a very good one. I'm generally very impressed by people. Um, so I'm trying to think like something that somebody did recently that I was just very delighted to be completely honest with you. Like I'm putting together an event right now that people talk about. Um, I asked somebody for their email address and then they sent it to me and I know that doesn't sound like a big deal. So, they followed through. They followed through simple like followed a very simple direction. Uh, and that simple direction I know it's it's it's me asking for email address and it doesn't sound like a big deal.

But when I'm asking a 100 people for their email addresses and I got to make sure that this is here and this is here, a simple like here you go. I mean,

PJ: so is that could be a few different things. Is it integrity because they did what they said they were going to do? Is it that it could be respect again that they respected you enough to follow through? What if you had to piece that apart? What do you think it would be? I

Sean: I it might also come down to respect because you know what it is. If this person knew that I've been that I was like sort of stressing about this kind of thing. So I don't know what this person was doing at the time. Maybe they were sitting home on their couch. Maybe they were at work. You know what? It doesn't matter. They took the time out of their day, whatever they were doing, and they said, "Yep, Sean needs this right now. Here you go."

Simple thing on their part, but to me, it just like speaks it's it's so important, you know what I mean? Um because yeah, it's it's I I very much I try to value other people's time because I expect my time to be valued like I just said.

Um so when somebody does something like that, again, I don't care what you're doing. If you're sitting on the couch, maybe it's just sitting on the couch time. You took time,

you took 10 seconds out of that. Well, hey, I appreciate it.

PJ: Right. when um Okay. Where did that come from? The respect then the the the desire for respect or the value of respect.

Sean: I tell you the being late thing came from my dad and my grandpa.

PJ: It did. So it came from growing up.

— Yeah. Yeah. And it was probably hardened in the military.

— Yeah.

— Yeah. Right. If you in early, you're late.

Sean: Yep. Which is where my dad and my grandpa's value was also hardened. So it's like generations of of of having that value and then going into a place that values that.

— Uh yeah.

PJ: So tell me this. Where does respect show up in jiu-jitsu?

Sean: Oh, everywhere. Yeah.

Yeah. So, you're doing something. I know. Like, this is gonna sound cheesy. It is what it is.

You're practicing hurting people.

PJ: Yeah.

Sean: I could right now like I don't know how much competitive training you have. I I

PJ: You could kick my ass.

Sean: I don't think I would have a problem choking you to death.

PJ: Yeah.

Sean: I'm not going to.

PJ: Yeah. Well, thank you.

Sean: Uh, you're welcome. Uh um likewise I am not the greatest jiu-jitsu practitioner in the world. I don't want to make any qualms about that. I am as average as it gets. I probably have a little bit more competition experience than people which means I also have more losses than people. Like it's it's I am not. So when I train with people that could probably more easily than I can go over there and choke you, they could do that to me and they don't. I mean I know you know is somebody gonna kill me on a jiu-jitsu mat? No. But you have to have some level of restraint and some level of respect for the person.

PJ: Yeah.

Sean: Or like let's say, you know, here we go. You're a new you're a new white belt. Maybe you've been training for 3 months and it's time for you to start rolling. That's what we call sparring. Um

you know, we're going and I have you in an arm bar and you don't have the experience to know that I have you dead to rights yet.

PJ: Oh yeah.

Sean: So what could I do? I could put it on really hard and maybe potentially injure you. or I could let you work, let you practice your defense, you know, let you do whatever, let you realize that you're in the position

and then, you know, you keep working. So, that's, you know, definitely like

you have that level of respect for people where you're like,

I'm at practice right now. I'm not going to seriously injure another person um just to just because I want to finish this move, right? Like just because I want to get my tap. It's it's, you know, it's especially when you're at like practice, like who cares, you know? Um, and so I'm I'm allowing you like I'm almost the respect thing comes in because I could make myself feel really good and finish you and tap you and all that, but instead I'm foregoing that and allowing you to learn in that moment, right?

Um, and and and you know, endless amounts of people have been that person for me, you know, and that's what we try to do for each other.

Um, I mean, there is just there's no shortage of ways I think respect shows up in jiu-jitsu. be because of the nature of what we're doing. You know, you could seriously hurt somebody and every time you don't seriously hurt somebody when you could have, I mean, that's a very very there has to be that level of respect there.

PJ: Absolutely.

Yeah. So, the reason I bring this up and I think that Thank you. Um, you you illustrated it beautifully. A lot of times I talk to people who are getting out. I see on LinkedIn, I see it in and you know, social media, Reddit, there's this desire for purpose

and that tends to be the thing that they focus on. You know, I went into my first job. I didn't feel like it matched. There was no purpose. I need I I hear the word and I see the word purpose a lot. And the hard part is you can't chase purpose. Purpose does not come from out there. It comes from in here a lot of times based on the stories we tell ourselves even. But the interesting thing that you you pointed out and I love that it worked out for you this way and and I love that this is this story is kind of going this way is that we actually kind of have things a bit backwards starting with value.

What are what do you value first and getting clear on that? Because there's pro there's probably so many things in the military that were trained in us. Man, I remember in the Marine Corps in the beginning, I was at OCS and like every single night you'd make your bed, you'd stand across the other side, you'd slap the bed, honor, courage, commitment. Like every single night, that's what they start with. They start with values.

Sean: Good

point.

PJ: You know what I mean? Being clear on our values as people and then building an identity around that as opposed to now using something external to define that in my opinion is is the place to start with transitioning out of the military because now it's something that's coming from within. You have control over it. It's no longer something that can be broken from out there. You know, now you're building a container around it that is not easily shattered such as like say you see this all 10 too, right?

What are you? I'm an engineer or I'm a I'm an entrepreneur. Right. You are until you aren't and then what? But building that identity instead of I'm a respectful person. Oh man, that lands differently.

Sean: Oh yeah.

PJ: You know what I mean? And then building the the purpose kind of comes out of that because now you're going to do everything you can. You you already talked about it. I eat healthy. I show up and I work out. Dude, that is part of the purpose that comes out of it, right? And it didn't it wasn't the other way around. You didn't go seek purpose. You started with something that was important to you, something that resonated with you. You have an identity that's built around that and with that, and now the purpose comes with it.

Sean: Yeah.

— Um, thank you.

— Yeah. Yeah. Thank you.

Sean: That was I'm glad you put it like that's that honestly like what you just said is very helpful. never thought about it that way. But I actually did have a moment where I when I when I got out that I did force myself to sit down and think about something and actually really helped with my transition. If you don't mind off that like this actually like something that I only realized I did recent well I knew I did at the time.

I think what you just said was like there's sometimes you need to like sit down and purposely think what are my values like you know like it's maybe even like write it down. You know what I mean? Like

PJ: you should write it down.

Sean: Yeah. Exactly. And and probably you have you sit down more than once

cuz you know one time you might say

PJ: and you should make a habit of that.

Sean: Yeah.

So this is actually how I ended up in marketing. Um

PJ: Okay.

Sean: Yeah. And so I at one point when I got out of the military I had read every trans horror story about transitioning. I knew people that had bad transitions and then so when I when I was in TAP I like I went to TAP and I like took every note I could. Took down everybody's phone number, email address, like things I didn't even like I was like is this important? I don't know. Write it down. So good. Yeah. and and and I because I didn't want to end up I mean it's like extreme but like I did not want to end up another statistic like I be that homeless veteran and be you know suicide like whatever I I was like I'm going to I had my wife at the time I was like I got I have to take care of her and my wife is very capable of taking care of her own self but you know you give yourself purpose exactly like we were talking about.

Um so I need like I don't have that option that's that's it's off the table. So, I sat down and I was thinking like I sat I purposely sat down and said to myself, "What are you good at?" And that's a hard conversation to have.

PJ: That is a hard conversation.

Sean: It's a very hard conversation to have. But like especially I think for veterans because I don't know about you, but nobody in the military ever asked me what I'm good at. Hey, what are you what are you good at? What do you like doing? Like

— uh

PJ: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Um you're you're right. I mean, a lot of times it's it's either recognized and identified or or you're placed somewhere.

Sean: You you'll get an award. Yeah. 100%. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And and you get you get an award here off. So, you're right. Yeah. But I think um that whole like questioning it's it's like one of those questions that you have to get your ego involved a little bit and that that's for me and I think for a lot of vets that's extremely challenging.

PJ: I think for veterans especially it's actually very challenging.

Sean: Yeah. Yeah. And so I had to say what am I good at? And and not just like what am I good at right now? Like what am I throughout my life have I been good at? And I started looking. I said, well, you know, I I played in the band. What was my role in the band? I was never the best musician. I was never the best songwriter, but I was responsible for us getting shows. I was responsible for us if we had to sell t-shirts or CDs, I was always the forefront of that.

Okay, interesting. You know, what do I like doing? Well, I did like photography. I've done stuff like that. And then I had a uh so I said, "Okay, there's there's got to be something in there, right?" And then I was doing an MBA program at the time. I had a marketing professor and I told him kind of like what I do and he actually he Air Force veteran. One of his clients sold like gear like plate carriers and helmets and stuff like that. So he actually asked him for my opinion on something.

So you're fresh out of the military. Can I get your opinion on this? And then I said, "Yeah." He said, "By the way, this guy's website is terrible. It sucks." Like I said, like and uh and then I said, "Well, here's what I've been doing for people and I've been like helping like promote themselves." He goes, "Oh, you're a marketer." And I was like, I don't know. I'm in this class to learn what marketing is. And he's like, no, what you just did is marketing. So, he kind of took me under his wing. Uh, but that only happened because I sat down and I thought I was like, what am I good at?

And like, what do I like doing? You know, what where and where do those things over overlap?

And it sounds like such obvious questions, but man, it was hard to answer.

PJ: Absolutely. Yeah.

Are you familiar with the Japanese ikigai?

Sean: No.

PJ: No. It's it's the overlap of the four circles. It's like, what am I good at? Okay.

Um, what do I enjoy doing? what can I make money doing and what does the world need? And like

Sean: I wish I'd seen that.

PJ: Yeah, it's the overlap of the four of those. That's the Japanese ikigai. Um, look it up. It's actually pretty cool.

And in fact, one of the cool things you can do is is go into like uh Claude or ChatGPT or whatever and ask it to ask you.

Interview me to help you figure out my my ikigai. Um, and the way you spell that, I'll drop it in the show notes, but a i ki g ai.

Um, so it sounds like that's what you did.

Sean: That's exactly what it did. Yeah, that's literally exactly what I did because I just said like, you know, and I also knew that like I I and I told my wife this. I say I didn't have a bad time in the military cuz I don't like to complain. Didn't exactly have a ton of fun. And I said to my wife like I mean, okay, I I had good times, had bad times, whatever. Sure. Just like anywhere else. I told my wife, I said, "Hey, before we got married, I said, just so you know, like if you're going to marry me, when I get out of the military, I'm going to do what I want to do. I don't know how much money I'm going to make because I didn't even know what that was at the time.

PJ: Yeah.

Sean: I said, "So, if that's not cool with you, fine. No problem. I understand. I just this isn't can't go further." And to her credit, she's like, "No, I get it." Cuz I said, "The military like a lot of times you're doing what other people tell you to do." And, you know, has to function like that. I'm not complaining. But I said, "When I get out, I'm doing what I want to do." Yeah. And

PJ: good on you for respecting her enough to be honest.

Sean: Yeah. I And and I give her all the credit in the world because I don't know how I'd handle it if somebody said that to is like the person you're going to spend the rest of your life with like is just like oh by the way I don't know I don't know if we're going to really make money like

oh by the way we're probably going to be broken under a bridge. Yeah, I know you want to have kids and all that, but uh um so um so yeah, it's that that was big, but uh not like just kind of tie this back in like jiu-jitsu is also the reason I got into doing what I do now was because it gave me like a stable platform to operate from. And you know, one of the ways I I was doing like some photo and stuff like that when I was in the band, but I really got back into photography and videography when I was in jiu-jitsu.

I got hurt, started taking pictures of people, people liked it. I started this page, got a decent following, and actually that page, like just a random Instagram page because of that page. I mean, I've been flown out to

numerous jiu-jitsu events to to, you know, do media and stuff like that. I don't do as much like the photo and video stuff on the marketing side these days. I'm a little more just like strategic level, but I still do it, you know,

do freelance stuff here and there. Um, but I wouldn't have had any of this. I wouldn't have had any of that if it wasn't for uh if it wasn't for the jiu-jitsu community. Um, and also just like I'm I'm an evangelist for jiu-jitsu. Now,

what people might not realize about our community is uh it's uh everybody's in there.

PJ: Yeah.

Sean: Like you literally have cops and criminals.

PJ: Sure. Absolutely.

Sean: Like cops and criminals. That's like the the stereotype, you know? It's like But in every jiu-jitsu gym, you have janitors, you have CEOs, you have accountants, you have whatever. So, if you're a transitioning veteran, I actually

PJ: networking,

Sean: dude. Jiu-Jitsu gyms are the best networking places because everybody trains there. And coming out of the military, I did not know what jobs there were in the civilian world. I knew like I I've had this conversation a lot, but like I'm coming out, I'm like, "Okay, well, I know like an accountant's a thing, but I don't like numbers." And I'm like, "I know a teacher is a thing. I don't know if I want to be a teacher." And I'm like, "Oh, that's all the civilian jobs I know." Um, obviously, you know, mechanic and stuff, but you know what I mean? You don't know what's out there. I did not know you could own a marketing company. Like, I did not know that was a thing. Um,

so, but being in the jiu-jitsu gym, you get exposed to all these different people. And I don't think I just generally didn't realize the value of networking. Um, in the military, I think I was actually pretty good at it. Like I was able to, like I said, I didn't do my job a lot because I made friends with the right people. That's literally how I did it. You know what I mean? I was like, you can't you can't just not do your job. Um, but networking when you get out is huge. And I think that's something that I wish

people would tell transitioning veterans more is that there is, especially if you live in a major city, there's networking groups all over.

— Oh, absolutely, dude. Meetup.com, like Event you know, all that stuff.

PJ: Yeah, I I totally agree with that. Actually, that's one of the things that I think saved me in in my transition was when I was getting out because I was med uh medical

was I went up to Seattle to do like a coding boot camp software engineer.

Sean: Nice.

PJ: And um I was I mean I had this Chrome extension that at the time I don't think you do this anymore, but it would like you would say, "Hey, I want to connect with this many people on LinkedIn that day and they need to meet this and this profile." and it was just a Chrome extension and I would just set it and forget it. And like every day I would connect with like a hundred plus software engineers and engineering managers. By the time I left that place I had like 5,000 connections.

Yeah. You know what I mean? My first job came from LinkedIn.

Sean: Wow.

PJ: You know what I mean? Networking.

Sean: That's And there's so many tools to do it. So many.

PJ: You know, um I actually really like that you're bringing up the community aspect of it. I went down to u the Military Influencer Conference last year and I was just interviewing spot interviews like random people and I was like if you could tell like transitioning veterans like one thing what would it be and I think it was like eight out of 10 we're like community find your community find your community

it is everything and it's cool that again you kind of fell into it so how how else would if we know how to break this down and become tactical with someone who's getting out like what would be some guidance that you would maybe give them to help identify maybe their community or whatever it may be like what would be the thing that you would tell them or suggest to them so that they could be successful?

Sean: Yeah. Um I just want to be careful with answering questions like this because I don't want to like have some illusion that I'm some crazy successful. Yeah. And but I yeah I think I have learned a thing or two. Um the number one thing and this has always come I guess this has always come natural to me. I don't think it's as sometimes easy for everybody but I don't care if it's natural for you or not. You have to do it. You have to do things like I've met people with plans on how to transition out. I'm gonna do X, Y, and Z blah blah blah blah blah. And then you follow up with them and they haven't

done it. Yeah.

And I know that sounds like a simple thing. Everything I talked about today is like simple simple things. Yeah. That's that's just how my brain works. Like

but so so we're talking about, you know, networking and trying to find your community. You have to go try it. So like let's say you know you're a software engineer. Just Google like software engineer meetups around me. Try it. Try it. And then maybe you go and they're like, "Ah, it's a bunch of losers. I don't want to go back." Cool. Don't go back. Would what'd you waste a couple hours? You know, you know what I mean?

PJ: Was the worst thing that happened.

Sean: Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Go. You You want to try jiu-jitsu? Come come into the gym. Not for you. No problem. Go try CrossFit. Try something, you know. Um but I think it's just take I think like to answer your question, like just take some action. I don't care what that action is, but get yourself used to taking that action. Um because again, you you had mentioned this earlier, when you're in the military, there's a lot that's done for you. Like as the thing I always use is like I never have to make my own dentist appointment.

Like I get I get an email and somebody like you have to go to the dentist this day. I'm like okay cool. And so I think like right you know and yeah

um little things like that where it's you don't even think about it but um

getting out and doing that's that's a huge part of it. And I think in that you'll you'll find something. You might not find what you thought you needed to find but you'll find something. For instance I went to a meetup one time. I won't say the topic because I don't want to give the meetup group away, but I thought it was the lamest thing I ever been to. I met a guy there and he was also like, "Is this the lamest thing you've ever been to?" I'm like, "Yeah, this is the worst." And I'm still friends with that guy. Like, you know what I mean? And so, it's it's it's funny. And then you start building your community that way.

Um

I I hope that answers your question. That's

PJ: it does actually. And and what's cool about that, too, is you're actually touching on it without maybe meaning to. Um values.

— Yeah. Is sometimes we don't know what those are.

PJ: Right. Right. Or sometimes we aren't necessarily clear on them. taking the action to get out and be somewhere that all of a sudden you're like, "Oh, well that's kind of cool. Here's a a hack." Ask yourself why, you know, go to that place. Why did you think it was cool or why did you think it was the lamest thing ever? Yeah,

that question why can actually illuminate a lot more than you think because now maybe it was maybe the instructor was late

and that touched on something that was disrespectful for me. Oh, wow. Maybe I have a a big value of respect. Where can I go that embodies or on a high level serves my value or a value of respect?

Sean: Yeah.

PJ: Oh my god. Now you just open a whole Pandora's box where maybe something will align more than than what it did before.

Sean: Yeah. Yeah. No, 100%. And exactly like I think everything you're saying actually everything you're saying today I'm going to write down after this because I think it's extremely useful because I think I've been doing a lot of what you're saying without um just like not like intentionally not purposely you know what I mean? I've never actually heard someone say this like this before. This is actually very valuable for me. Thank you. Um

PJ: thank you.

Sean: Um I do want to everything we've talked about right now is sort of circling the wagons of this foundation that I work with and that I would love the opportunity to talk about if you don't mind.

PJ: Please do. Yeah.

Sean: Um, so talk about helping other veterans. You do your stuff. Uh, phenomenal work from what I've been told. Uh, helping veterans transition out. That's I don't think there's there's very few more worthy causes. The way I kind of do my part is because I have no other personality besides jiu-jitsu. I try to help the veteran community from within jiu-jitsu. Um, so I work for a foundation. I'm currently the Philadelphia what is my title? The Philadelphia area representative, something like that for the WeDefy Foundation. It's a volunteer position. I don't have to know what it's called. Uh,

I I think I'm taking over uh the state of Pennsylvania soon. Um or if I it might already be I might already be it. I'm not sure. Most of our stuff in Pennsylvania happens around Philly. So um

PJ: yeah,

Sean: but uh but so what we do at the foundation is uh we provide scholarships to a jiu-jitsu gym, one-year scholarships uh for any combat disabled veteran with a VA rating of 80% and up. So, if you'd like to apply for one of our scholarships, what we'll do is

you um you get in as long as you, you know, hit the qualifications and we have like different rounds when we take applications, but if you're watching this and that sounds like you, put the application in now, just put the application in anytime and then when it's time for us to review them, you'll get like an email or something.

PJ: Yeah,

we'll we'll drop the link in the show notes.

Sean: Thank you. That'd be great. Um and so what we do is we put you in a jiu-jitsu gym for one year. We pay for everything. You don't got to pay for the membership. You don't have to pay for uh you know, if it's a gi, if you're doing gi, no gi, whatever. will ditch a uniform. We'll even give you a mentor.

PJ: Wow.

Sean: And our mentors are veterans that are between a uh a blue and brown belt. So, it's like blue, purple, or brown belt. Um many of them have been through the program before, but not everyone. But at least, you know, you're going to get a veteran, you're going to get somebody who trains. The only thing we ask the only thing we ask of the people who receive these scholarships is that you show up. That's it.

All you got to do show up to class couple days a week. You know, you and your mentor figure out how many days realistically you can do. We don't have like, you know, if you don't show up two days a week, your scholarship's gone. out just you figure it out. And we have seen we're actually we're uh funding a study right now uh all about community and veteran mental health

PJ: really

Sean: because we have seen such a I mean such a positive impact from doing this. We're in a nationwide um foundation headquartered in Dallas, Texas. Uh we have we're at least a thousand volunteers strong. I want to say there's there's probably more at this point. Um, and we've put thousands of athletes through our program. Um, and and I mean the great

here's why I'll just continue to sing jiu-jitsu praises. The reason it's helpful for veterans, the reason it's helpful for that is as one major thing as we talk about is community. I'm going to put you in a supportive community. You know what I mean? If you're not supportive in your jiu-jitsu community, you typically don't last. There's not a lot of room for like, don't get me wrong, you're going to find guys with egos. You're going to find people you don't like, of course. But what you're going to find generally is a group of supportive people. And that's a group of people that typically hold each other accountable

because if you know you and I if if we train together I don't see you for a week

I'm going to be texting you be like yo dude like what's up like everything good like are you traveling you know whatever and um you know little things like that you know and typically like if you're gone for a week I'm going to know why you know it's just like not not that it results business but like

it's just it's it's that level of community also I mean you can't disregard the the benefit of physical activity

PJ: absolutely

Sean: it's physical activity is everything and you're going to get that in jiu-jitsu And yeah,

you know, it's good for your it's good it's good for your body. It's also good for, you know, we have a lot of veterans unfortunately that, you know, they probably drink a little bit too much. Maybe you're doing some drugs, like whatever. If that's you, I don't care. I you please apply for one of our scholarships. If you don't feel like you're physically ready, I we're don't let that be a factor. If you have been dealing with whatever, just just apply. Just apply. We want to see you there.

Reason being is uh and I put it this way because it tends to stick to people. Uh if it's Saturday morning and there is a 200 pound dude uh trying to choke you um and it is 9:00 on Saturday morning and this dude's sweating in your face while he's grabbing your collar and trying to make it so you can't breathe anymore. Um you start thinking about maybe I shouldn't have had that third or fourth drink last night.

— I'm a little hung over right now.

Sean: Yeah. And trust me, we've all been there. Uh but uh yeah and it's uh and so that's the little things that I think have like a huge impact on people

like uh you know if if if if drinking is a problem

I I mean you know we don't have doctors we don't have professionals if you need profession you know go see a professional we're not a substitute for any type of professional doctor what we are is a community and an activity where that type of thing happens where we talked about before who's going to quit smoking the guy said I've been not smoking for 10 or whatever you can we want to switch your identity to, you know, maybe somebody who has a drinking problem to somebody who does jiu-jitsu and is fit and is this and you know that.

So that's the kind of impact we are trying to have. Not a substitute, like I said, for professional help or whatever, but we're giving you we're going to give you that. And you know, I'm just using alcohol as an example. People overeat, people whatever, anxiety, deps, like trust me, I've been there. you don't want to leave your house, you don't whatever. If we can get you into a gym, couple weeks, get you a community positive place. I I've just I've seen it do so much for so many like you would not I mean you said you believe it. Yeah. Yeah. Sorry. I'm like about to say I meant to like have habits that you would not believe. I because I know you've you've seen

these types of transitions people have like night and day, man. Like

my friend um let's use first name. My friend Kyle, he didn't go through our program, but he used jiu-jitsu. I mean, he was an addict. Um, you know, had a family, but like maybe wasn't as involved as he as he should have been. And he credits jiu-jitsu, army veteran, you know, army combat veteran, early like early days of GWOT, like Iraq, Afghanistan. He did the whole thing. Army infantry guy, you know, as whatever typical story, right? Army infantry guy, early GWOT gets out, gets put on a bunch of painkillers, gets addicted, you know, I'll let him tell a story if he ever wants to, but man, like he sings jiu-jitsu's praise.

I don't think he mind me talking about it either cuz he talks about this kind of stuff a lot and I've seen it like he was like the first guy I knew that happened to and then I found this foundation and that's what they do. Um

so yeah man it's it's and then also I just want to touch on like I said the physical benefit but I think physical and mental are pretty tied

PJ: 100%.

Yeah it's pretty tied into mind body connection dude.

Sean: Exactly. one doesn't exist without the other, you know, it's it's so you know, you're also getting a chance to exercise your mind, which I think sometimes people when they maybe get out of the military or whatever, like they don't you be maybe you would be surprised, but some people would be surprised to know like some people don't use their brain. And I don't mean that like in like a silly like kind of like you're not challen you're not I shouldn't say you don't use your brain. People some people don't challenge themselves.

PJ: Actually, I I'm glad you said it that way because you're not wrong.

Sean: Yeah,

PJ: it it's I think there's a reactive way to use your brain. Um, and that's probably what you're referring to is is I'm being reactive to the thoughts and the feelings and the stories and the stuff that are going on and I'm letting them happen.

Sean: Yes.

PJ: As opposed to being more proactive and being and recognizing that, okay, there's that story. I can rather react to it in this way or maybe I can think about it in a different way. And how does how does jiu-jitsu play into that?

Sean: Yeah. So the the one one major thing the the benefit that I I get and I I read books and I you know I I try to keep my brain proactive but jiu-jitsu is a neverending learning experience. You will never know all of jiu-jitsu you because it changes like I mean I know guys that have been training for 30 40 years that like the sport changes and the activity changes. Some people don't even like like actually the sport and the self-defense and this that like just has a lot of different ways you can go with it. It's not really like one thing. Um, but man, I'm constantly learning. Yeah.

And that it's so powerful, man. You know, it's so powerful. I think a lot of us even when you leave school, like, you know, it's it's you don't you're not constantly in that like I need to learn this. I need to figure this out. Some people like, you know, you get a job and and nothing wrong with it, but maybe you get a job, but doesn't require a lot of mental, you know, t taxing or whatever. And now, okay, well, if you're at your job 8 hours a day and then you go home and you watch TV and you eat dinner and then you go to bed, like you're never exercising that part of your brain.

Whereas, like with jiu-jitsu, it gives you a reason to do that. Especially when you're like brand new and you can't figure anything out. Like, and you are you're like relearning some I've watched people, it happens all the time like people relearn how to use their brain. They relearn how to learn. Like I'm teaching Yeah. I'm teaching them something and then they go like, you know, oh man. Like I've dude, not an exaggeration. I have taught people where I am like okay now move your left hand and they're so caught up in their brain like I don't know how to do that I don't like what like I

exactly how I'm studing now that's what they're doing I go move your left hand and then their right hand moves because they're so not used to having to think through a problem anymore that they're just like they're they're gone

PJ: well they're focused yeah in one spot I actually I love that you brought this up I I use this metaphor a lot where like when you learn new things it's You have this iceberg in your brain and there's so many penguins on the iceberg and you have to like make room. So you have to like shove some penguins off the iceberg to make room for new penguins.

Sean: Yeah.

That's I like it.

— Uh Mario.

PJ: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But but actually, you know, as silly as that is, if if we're in those areas like you're talking about where I'm not maybe using my brain so much at work or I'm not being mentally stimulated,

I'm not making room for new penguins. So, I'm being I'm using the same old penguins all the time.

Sean: All the time.

I'm going to be talking about penguins a lot today.

PJ: But, you know, you use those same penguins all the time. And a lot of times, a lot of times, those penguins aren't serving you in the way that they could be.

And if you push them off the iceberg and now all of a sudden you have some new penguins that are like, "Maybe I have to learn XYZ maneuver. Maybe I'm not circling on the same old thing anymore."

Yeah. Maybe it's just not occupying space in my brain in the same way that it used to before. And now all of a sudden I'm doing something that is putting me in a better mental space than it was before. I think there's a lot of power in that.

Sean: Yeah. Yeah. And I think that's you know that's you know I know I I've spent a lot of time talking about all the benefits of jutsu and why we why I'm so tied to it. But like I wouldn't be talking about this stuff if I hadn't seen it help people.

PJ: Yeah. Yeah.

Sean: You know what I mean? And and it's not just for vet. If you're listening this you're not a veteran. Please go train ju. it'll still have, you know, I think still has benefits. Um, but the reason you we do what we do at the foundation is just because, man, like I'm not a doc. I don't know what the mechanisms in your brain are that make you seek community that make you learn. I don't like I'm not My wife is actually a PhD scientist. She probably knows uh she hasn't pulled me, but uh she uh go and ask all Yeah, exactly.

All I know is I have seen many people at this point from like year or day one they get our scholarship, they put their gi on, they don't know how to tie their white belt so it looks all crooked and and and they're just like they're they're carrying themselves one way and then a year later that's not even that much time. A year later, man, I'm talking like they've repaired relationships with their family. There's like And by the way, we don't do any of that. We don't like facilitate a phone call with your aranged, you know, kids or something like that. People do that on their own.

PJ: Yeah.

Sean: And it's like, okay, maybe I'm not smart enough to know why this happening, but I am smart enough to see that it is happening and that we need to keep doing it because it's the impact it's having on our community,

which is a community that is suffering. It's just like how could I if I see that like

you're probably the same way. How could I see that work and then not do everything in my power to to keep doing it to keep it happening to get to more people? That's that that's so that's where I am. Like I get I get pretty passionate about this kind of stuff and I talk about it a lot and sometimes I'm worried like I'm talking about too much and I'm annoying people. But it's like

it's I like I don't know if this annoys you like we're we're probably just not meant to be friends. But like it's you know what I mean? It's one of those things where you can't watch your community suffer so much and then have something that helps and not go like we're all in, you know? It's it's and I think a lot of us are like that. It's not unique to me.

PJ: Let's abstract that because I I agree. I think that this is something that's worked really really well for you and you've seen the beauty in it and you've seen the power in it and what it can do.

There's lots of things like this 100%.

There's, you know, hey, before you joined the military, did you like mountain biking? Did you like riding horses? Did you like archery? Did you like playing music? Whatever. Whatever. Did you like knitting scarves? You know, there's so many different things and there are communities for all of this, you know. Yeah. Um I think jiu-jitsu has a lot of those six human needs that I talked about at a very very high level. And I can see why that would work.

— And if it's not for you,

— go find go find yours.

— Plenty of

PJ: I promise you it exists. I promise you, in fact, I promise you that it exists from a veteran standpoint. Look at, you know, Project Healing Waters. You want to go fly fishing? Go fly fishing with a bunch of Vietnam vets and let them tell their war stories, you know, like it's it is it's funny, but it's also it actually is a lot of fun. There's so many different things like that out there. And I would I would urge you to do Yes.

Get out there and do in order to in order to change your life because it exists and a lot of times it just takes getting off that couch or whatever it may be. What's your favorite book?

Sean: Man, that's a good question. All right. So, I'm gonna talk through this answer because I don't I Let's see. I mean, I think I brought him up earlier, but like

I was almost kind of like saying how much I don't like this kind of stuff, but I think Jocko's book Extreme Ownership is a book everybody should read.

PJ: Yeah, I totally agree

Sean: because it's like the concept is so unbelievably simple. um where it's just like hey like it basically just comes down to like do stuff and own the things you do. It's like so simple. So I that book like I think is a phenomenal book. Um

I think uh if you want to like get a little old school Book of Five Rings uh Miyamoto Musashi.

PJ: Okay.

Sean: I am not like

I am pretty surface level. I am like I am not like the the deepest philosophical person in the world. Um, that book though speak just spoke to me in like a way that I kind of started understanding. Um,

PJ: nice.

Sean: Yeah. Yeah. Um, I'm trying to think what else. Dang, I know there's some good ones. Uh, if you like, this is going to sound like crazy. I like I'm like really into like aliens and outer space and stuff like that. That is like that's my whole jam. Like all like my logos for my companies are all like oh funny

aliens themed. Yeah. And so, uh, I, uh, Secret Machines by, uh, Tom DeLonge from Blink is

PJ: Oh, really?

Sean: It's a great book. It's funny. So good. Uh, the whole secret mach Yeah. It's like a whole, uh, he's got like a bunch of like things he's put out under like To the Stars Academy and like

I like I didn't want myself to just like it because it was Tom DeLonge.

PJ: Yeah.

Sean: And it's I It's just

PJ: Oh, I'm have to check that out. That's kind of funny. So good. All his Yeah. his little

— I just uh I just read or listened to um The Storyteller with Dave Grohl.

— Oh,

— and I didn't realize that I guess I should have realized this that Foo Fighters the name Foo Fighters. Yeah. Really aliens,

— too. Yeah. Um anyway, um I read Mark I read I also read Mark Hoppus's uh biography recently. Oh, really? Yeah. Yeah. Very good.

— Interesting. Yeah.

— I want check that out, too.

Sean: It's funny. Sorry. I know. Like those books are like it's like a crazy span of like I'm just trying to think of things I've read recently. I always have a terrible time remembering.

PJ: No, that's good. Do you have a favorite podcast?

Sean: Uh, yeah, I listen to quite a bit of podcasts. Um, for comedy, uh, a podcast you might not have heard of, uh, it's pretty popular now, but it's called Are You Garbage? Fantastic podcast. Okay. Um, if you want a comedy podcast if you want to like learn, uh, I'm a I'm a big Lex Fridman fan. Lexman Lex got his black belt at my gym.

PJ: Did he really?

Sean: Yeah.

— So,

PJ: interesting. Where is he? He's in

Sean: He's in Austin now. But yeah, I think his dad still lives in Philly, but he did his PhD at Drexel.

PJ: Interesting.

Sean: Yeah. Yeah. So, Lex uh am a big Lex Fridman. Um

trying to think what was I just listening to on the way here. Uh I pull up my phone to check.

PJ: Yeah, man. Do it.

Sean: Uh what do I like here?

PJ: And we'll drop this all in the show notes. You should do.

Sean: Yeah. Um, I think I mean obviously Shawn Ryan's been putting out some awesome stuff. Uh, if you want to get political, Part of the Problem with Dave Smith, maybe maybe some of you don't want to listen to that stuff, but I don't know. I just like uh I I listen to podcast. I think a lot of people too, different reasons. That's why I started. I was like, here's a comedy one because here's one everybody can now. Here's a little more niche stuff. And I I listen to all like the big podcasts, you know, like Shawn Ryan, Broen, like all that stuff.

Um, I listen to a lot of comedy podcasts like Yeah. Yeah. I I I think I because I use podcasts as a way to like take a mental break. Um

PJ: that's funny actually because to me I I use them to learn.

Sean: I do I do that as well.

PJ: Especially if you're talking like Lex Fridman. I feel like Lex Fridman.

Sean: Well, when I'm ready to like jump into like Lex Fridman or Huberman or something like that like you know what I don't listen to? I don't listen to like any marketing shows.

PJ: Oh, really?

Sean: I tend to

PJ: That's actually surprising for someone in marketing.

Sean: Yeah. Yeah. Not because I don't think they have information I could use, but like I think a lot of marketers are just insufferable people, myself included. Like if if I never hear Alex Hormozi talk another word in my life, I will be happy.

PJ: Wow. Okay.

Sean: All respect due to him. I just it's something about the way those guys talk just does not resonate with. Yeah. Yeah. I

like Simon Sinek. He's cool.

— He's actually Yeah. Um

PJ: Well, I appreciate that, man. Do you have anything you want to leave the audience with?

Sean: Can I You mind if I plug my event fundraiser? Okay. So June 20th, if you're around June 19th and 20th, the 20th will be a little more relevant for you if you don't train. Uh we are having a WeDefy Foundation uh super like super card super fight card um on June 20th on board the battleship the USS New Jersey. Yeah. Which is parked right in the Delaware River off of Camden, New Jersey. So if you are in that area um if you are in that area and you're a jiu-jitsu fan or if you are not a jiu-jitsu fan, I am making the card along with my friend Zach Mlani who runs uh finishers. sub only one of the top regional organizations in the country. Uh we are matchmaking that card specifically with matches that are going to be entertaining to people who train jiu-jitsu and people who do not train jiu-jitsu.

PJ: Interesting.

Sean: So we want you to be able to show up to this and you have no idea what jiu-jitsu is. We're going to show you a showcase of it. We have some of the top athletes in the world um that we are we are booking. It's a lot of our friends and you know the people um that are coming. They are um I was going to say they are we got people flying in. We got whatever. This whole card is a fundraiser for the foundation. I'm making zero money doing this.

Zach's making zero money doing this. Nobody is making any money. Every ticket sale, 100% of that is going to the WeDefy Foundation to help get combat veterans into jiu-jitsu. If you do train June 19th, we're also going to be on the battleship doing a jiu-jitsu seminar. Right now, we have three instructors. By the time this comes out, they will be announced. Um Amanda Levy, one of the top uh I mean was just one of the top athletes in the past like 10 years at this point.

She's 2 and0 in the PFL. That's crazy story. She had like a medical condition, couldn't do MMA anymore, transition to jiu-jitsu, made it to ADCC Worlds. Crazy. Wow. Kevin Dancler, who is about to fight Mikey or about to compete against Mikey Musumeci, who that name probably means nothing to you, but if you like jiu-jitsu, that he's basically the top guy in the sport. Kevin is on the main event of UFC BJJ going against Mikey at the end of May. Uh he will be one of our instructors.

And then we have John Thor Blank, um, IBJJF, Nogi, PANS winner, ADCC Worlds this year, won ADCC East Coast Trials, absolute stud. So those are our three instructors. We have a fourth one that's going to be announced a little closer to the event. Little little surprise. Um, yeah. So, uh, that's going to be awesome. So, that is June 19th and 20th, USS New Jersey, uh, Camden, New Jersey. Please, we'll have tickets up, uh, for sale May 8th, which I believe this will come out afterwards. Uh,

PJ: uh, yeah. Probably right after.

Sean: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, we'll have tickets for sale May May 8th. Again, it's I would not plug it this much if it was just for me. This is for the organization. It's going to be a great time. Come learn about jiu-jitsu. See what we do.

PJ: Can anybody go or veterans only? Okay.

Sean: Nope. Anybody is welcome to come. Please come. Bring your Bring your kids. Bring your mom. Bring your dog. I don't I don't know if you're actually don't know if you're dogs.

I don't know if you're allowed to bring your dog on the ship. You might. I don't know. I'll check. Uh tell tell what. Send me a DM. Ask about the dog.

PJ: Awesome. How can people get a hold of you?

Sean: Um I'm pretty active on Instagram. You can either uh personal is uh Sean I'll sure we'll link it but Sean Rob show but my name's spelled different spelled s h o w because people don't speak French and they can't say my name

but if you're interested in jiu-jitsu you can follow people doing martial arts that's my like jiu-jitsu photography and content page so if you like photography like jiu-jitsu it's a good good fun follow.

PJ: Yeah, cool, man. I appreciate you.

As usual, we'll drop that all in the show notes.

I really appreciate your time. I really appreciate your wisdom.

Uh, if you know the drill, my friends, and I know I say that at the end of every single episode. However, it would really mean a lot if you would like subscribe. Share this with people who you think could benefit. If you know someone who's transitioning out of the military or who has transitioned out of the military, maybe is struggling or maybe even not, um, just go ahead and send this to them. maybe it would be something that resonates. If you have any feedback at all, please please drop it into the comments.

This is how we get better. And I don't know if you've noticed, but we're constantly changing things up, trying to see what works, trying to see what uh can make this a better podcast and serve this community to a higher level. I appreciate you all and I hope you have a good time.